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1 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 4:32:03am

Since we're now talking about the hidden oppression within Israeli culture, some questions might be necessary to lay the groundwork for discussion. For instance, do you know the difference between modern Orthodox and what is called 'ultra-orthodox'? Did you know that there is a large difference between the two subcultures? The article didn't seem to make a distinction.

Are these groups fighting for stagnation, to remain the same, or are there significant movements within certain groups to modify traditions, which very well could lead to different outcomes when the World Economic Forum comes a' callin' next time?

What kinds of discussion might take place in an 'ultra-orthodox' family that might lead to the decision for one spouse to work and the other to say home with the children, since there are more children?

All of these issue might be relevant when one gets closer than a football field to some numbers that from that far distance appear significant.

2 CuriousLurker  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 6:34:12am

re: #1 Bob Levin

I actually spent a good part of my weekend reading about all the different levels of observance in Judaism, the different types of Zionism, and the current political parties in Israel (including their origins). It's quite a lot to sort through—so much so that I began making index cards to divide them into digestible bits. O_o

3 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 9:25:00am

re: #2 CuriousLurker

This type of thing frequently happens when baseball season ends. ;-)

Seriously, we have enough trouble trying to figure out who we are. It's not so easy. The most ironic thing, given this almost constant level of fragmentation--with the exception of only a few brief moments in our history--is that the shortest distance to our disappearance would be to leave us alone, to give us the same rights as everyone else.

But the constant pressure to destroy us is really what keeps us together. And it keeps us strong enough to survive. But to the truly antisemitic, the Jews are that one piece of chocolate on the kitchen table. They can't resist. The short term promise of sadism is too much to pass up.

4 Bob Levin  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 9:49:46am

re: #2 CuriousLurker

You want the links, right. There aren't any, really. However, there is what is called a code. That is, the truly antisemitic speak in a code. Ron Paul is probably the most fluent in code.

It would be better to learn the code. The Iran's of the world, the KKK's of the world, do not speak in code. But it's like we're fighting a two headed snake. The overt side isn't as dangerous as the covert side. The covert side is in the enlightened parts of the world. They are like Mearsheimer and Walt. How many years were they teaching, quietly going about their business, teaching many students, keeping as low as they could? Then they popped their heads from under the rock, they spoke openly, abandoned the code, and as a result, have lost all credibility.

The secret is to speak the code and retain credibility, and hence also retain the power to persuade.

I googled 'anti semitic code', and as with anything, many pages popped up, none that I could see are worth anything. Nothing concrete. But, I suppose that's the point. It's Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle of Hatred.

You know a good example, the doctor in Gentleman's Agreement. The code is the Gentleman's Agreement. Peck teases out the code from the threads of normal, harmless, conversation. Remember the phrase--it's found among the nice people, the good people.

5 CuriousLurker  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 3:48:15pm

re: #3 Bob Levin

re: #4 Bob Levin

Many thanks for the additional insights. I'll keep digging, making notes, and cross-referencing until a clearer picture emerges. Perhaps as I finish researching the different aspects (observance, Zionism, political parties, etc.) I'll post summaries here of my understanding so that you guys (Jewish members) can elaborate by way of correction and/or added nuance.

Hmm, maybe I should create a poll to see how much enthusiasm there is (or isn't) for that idea...


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